The debate ensued tonight between Rob and I regarding the sacredness of human life versus nonhuman life. I strongly believe that Human life is the most sacred, and for many reasons. He thinks that life is life is life is life is life…..his life is no more important than a cow’s life, or a chicken’s life.
By his reasoning I cannot see the reason he is not a vegetarian at least, vegan at extreme. I read someplace that his line of reasoning should denote just that…such a view ought to quell his taste for the flesh of an animal. Our farm should only be vegetables.
I believe Human life is the most sacred of all life. I beleive this because 1) as humans our brains are evolved to the point of knowledge 2)we have free will 3)we are not driven by instict alone 4)we contribute to the advancement (and sometimes decay because of our knowledge,) of society and our race of animal in general 5)we are the only animal to have a concept of the afterlife.
I honestly think his notion is foolish and I have told him so. I think it is defeatist, self loathing and martyr-like. He has spoken to the effect many times of hating being human. That he is ashamed of it. I cannot understand this viewpoint at all. To be so self loathing as a human. Yikes.
This debate got sparked because of an episode of “Friends”. It’s the episode where Phoebe finds a cat and thinks it is her dead mother reincarnated. I do believe in reincarnation, but I do not believe we reincarnate as other animals, only as humans. Rob mentioned that he’d enjoy coming back as a sea otter or a May fly. He went on to explain the May fly. He said in the span of 24 hours the May fly is born, eats, has sex, and dies. The span of human life in 24 hours. Tell me that is not self loathing and defeatist.
How does a person come to his conclusion? He hasn’t the ability to tell me, so I ask you all, fair readers. Do any of you hold to this line of reasoning?
First of all,,, For a long time I have admired you and your lifestyle. I like your natural approach to (almost) everything. I really like how your presence is doing this community a lot of good, on many fronts. It seems that we never had an opportunity to chat that was relaxed enough to let me tell you that.
Now, the question at hand…
After studying and pondering life for a long time, step by step I became convinced that everything is alive. If anybody has a spirit or soul, it became clear to me that everything has spirit, just to different degrees. Everything is part of several different systems. You may simultaneously be part of a family, a school, a city, a country, a church, a business, several clubs, your local ecology, etc.
Your body is made of 10 trillion of your own cells plus 90 trillion cells of bacteria, viruses, and other bugs. It is a complex interwoven system that acts together and creates the earthly YOU. It supports your spirit, just as you support and affect the spirit of organizations you are part of.
The spirit also supports and affects the members.
It is both a bottom up and a top down process.
The smaller we look, the more tiny complex systems we see. The larger we look, the more big slow complex interactive systems we see.
Everything is SO interconnected and overlapping and part of so many living entities, how can we be so self centered as to think that only humans have a soul? Or only a certain kind of biology is alive? Or my soul resides only in this body?
We are one. In so many ways.
I guess the Zen Buddhist got what he asked for when he ordered his pizza…
He said “Make me one with everything’”
Thank you, Paul, for your words. I understand where you are coming from and I do have to make the point that I too, believe that everything has a soul that is alive. I often find it QUITE hard to eat ANYTHING because of this (obviously I have succeeded though ha ha!) ESPECIALLY animal life. How does one reconcile that animal life is just as sacred while tearing into a nice juicy steak? If we are all one, then we eat of our own souls it seems.
Maybe I ought to keep the existential thoughts off my blog, huh? lol!
While being a may fly in my next life sounds incredibly wonderful some days, I do agree with you in your thoughts as to humans holding something that other life here on Gaia doesn’t. Even though everything is interconnected, all spirit, we are here because we were asked to be. Other life was invited as well, but not to co-create, simply to co-exist. We are co-creators with Gaia, and companion her consciously in her evolution. We are her sacred companions, holding space for her, healing her, guiding her, and growing with her, as she does for us. If life comes to support Gaia consciously, then I believe it is a higher level of sacredness. But, do all humans come to support Gaia? There have, in the past, been races of beings that came to experience something upon Gaia’s body that caused her great grief and left energetic fissures in her energetic body that allows for great discord today, usually evidenced in the nature of humans that dwell within these spaces. Those that are aware of the spirit within all life, and the ability to shift and heal old energy, are here for her, for her healing and our co-evolution. I feel you know this, and are doing this. It is the basis of your existence, to dance and grow with Gaia, hence your journal’s name. But for those that do not claim the knowledge of the human sacredness are probably those that don’t consciously claim their scared contract with Gaia, and are probably thinking of all the dark and sordid acts of humanity that keep us and Gaia in pain and compression. I can see both points, and agree with both.
I have met animals that told me they were of a human consciousness, holding the same spirit within as they would in a human body. I have met humans that long to return to being an animal and hold great love for animals that baffle me, because I have never wanted to be an animal in this lifetime. But I have had one lifetime as a tigress, and it was powerful and wonderful.
So, you are both right in my eyes.
And what does conscious mean- it’s not simply being aware of being alive, as life knows it’s living, it’s more, because I don’t believe all humans are conscious. It’s knowing our ability to speak and interact with spirit, to co-create with spirit beyond simply the birth-death-birth-death cycle. It’s claiming the power within to create, simply beyond knowing, and it’s acting upon that power for the reason why were we called into our awakening, the remembering of the godforce within, to active and transition energy. We are first and foremost spirit, and our human bodies are the vehicles for transformation in this earthly plane. When we claim this knowledge, we are awake, and are co-creators and conscious companions of Gaia. We then can help her heal and evolve, as within ourselves.
We are becoming luminous beings, transitioning into conscious life infused with light, the light of source and core essence.
Ah, I’ll stop know. This is a favorite subject of mine. Please post your thoughts here, as they spark consciousness within.
Blessed be,
Amber Dragonfly
on the subject of humans incarnating as another animal…perhaps I dont believe we do because I haven’t ever and have never felt in this life like it’d be a great thing. I CHERISH the human experience. I have suffered in the human experience, in this life and others, but I still come back because it’s that amazing!
Amber, I think you have hit on something big regarding the two levels of thinking, those who have claimed their contract and those that have not. If you ever have the opportunity to be in an existential conversation with Rob, you’ll hear the latter idea come through clearly. He really thinks that human beings are a virus, a plague on Mother Earth. He doesn’t see any of the good that we have accomplished and shared with Her. I find this entirely frustrating, because how could he pro-create if he didn’t believe that humanity is at least a little worthwhile? I think he really does believe that human life is most sacred, but he has been wounded in past lives as well. He has been a crusader, seeing the worst of humanity, among other incarnations he has had.
I, too, have seen the darkest parts of humanity, but I STILL come back as human because somehow I STILL believe in the goodness and light of humanity and our collective purpose here.
I, too, could talk on this for quite some time. Zoe is putting the play doh away because we are off to Share N Care….gotta pick up a kids size sweater…we had an arrival last night of a kid! YAY! The does are surprising us! they have kids in their wombs after all! HUZZAH! Photos are forthcoming.
You might like these books… “A Language Older Than Words” by Derrick Jensen, “Spiritwalker” by Hank Wesselman, and “Communicating With Orcas” by Mary Getten.
What do you mean by “point of knowledge”? Animals gather and maintain knowledge in a very detailed way, as do plants, to survive and thrive in their surroundings. Other beings have free will as well – they make conscious decisions just as we do.
I find that the times humans are driven by anything Other than instinct is when we run into trouble. Shouldn’t our deepest instinct be to protect the land we live on so that it can continue to support us? What is more important than that?
What do you consider “advancement”?
I believe that other creatures have concepts of afterlife. Just because humans may not be able to communicate with other beings doesn’t mean they don’t conceive of afterlife.
Hi. What a beautiful weblog and lifestyle you have
I don’t believe humans are the most sacred lifeform for the reason that we simply don’t know what is going on in the minds and hearts of animals. We can study them, project our theories on them, but we can not experience their inner lives and so really don’t know if they think and feel at the same level as us. Besides which, I would not say a mentally retarded person is less sacred a lifeform than I, so the same principle applies with animals and plants for me.
Also, I don’t believe in reincarnation, I believe we spiral up and onwards, and I believe I have personal evidence for that. I believe all souls do so – humans, animals, plants.
We are all one together. We nourish each other. I eat plants, and sometimes animals, because I must eat. Animals eat animals and plants. Even plants derive their energy from other living things. It’s how it works. I don’t have a problem with it, but I do give thanks for the nourishment, the gift.
Thank you for the interesting discussion.